Comments on: Drop IDEA, move to Eclipse? No open source license from IntelliJ

By: stephan

stephan — Tue, 26 Aug 2008 06:06:19 +0000

@Jose: You won’t regret it, IDEA 8.0M1 is great – even better than 7.0 (Performance and features)

By: Jose

Jose — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 18:13:22 +0000

I just started delving into IntellijIDEA 7.0. I am a fervent Eclipse user (4 years using it). I tried Netbeans, it looks nice, great as an RCP, but haven’t given it the time it needs. I downloaded IDEA after a fellow employee “preached the Good News” to me. It looks interesting, chock full of many features. My trial ends September 21, still trying to get over the learning curve. I may convert in the next couple of weeks; we’ll see… :)

By: Nadav

Nadav — Sun, 27 Jan 2008 02:26:06 +0000

While there’s a jungle of features, Eclipse is centered around the Eclipse-Platform (basically notepad on steroids with a project workspace), and the Eclipse-Java-Development-Tools (Java development support on top of Eclipse-Platform).

The default distribution throws in stuff like Team Support (a generic SCM facade with CVS bindings builtin), Task Management(Mylyn), and so on, and so forth.

Eclipse also provides other distributions (web development, embedded development, C/C , etc…), but it is often superfluous in my opinion (I particularly dislike Eclipse WST).

Eclipse has grown a lot and still is (I think I read somwhere: ~7M lines of code in 3.2, ~17M lines of code in 3.3), but most of this stuff just sits in the plugin repository and never gets installed — the base product hasn’t grown THAT much.

If you ever want to shed some Eclipse bloat, just download Eclipse Platform and cherrypick your features through the update-manager. I find that Eclipse JDT is actually very good (supposedly less refactorings than in IDEA, but a lot more than NetBeans), and the Eclipse compiler (yes, they wrote their own compiler) is very fast. Eclipse Mylyn is always a must for me, and I’m hoping for a Eclipse or Selenic backed Mercurial plugin.

Word of advice regarding not having the developer in mind: have a look at Eclipse Mylyn, it really makes a developer’s life simpler while maintaining large projects, and helps distribute tasks w/o encumbering the workflow.

By: stephan

stephan — Mon, 14 Jan 2008 05:17:06 +0000

Eclipse performance is sad. I mean … everything I do in Eclipse causes my 2ghz, 4gb Core Duo to hang.

By: John

John — Mon, 14 Jan 2008 03:30:54 +0000

IDEA performance is sad compared to Eclipse. I mean.. everything I do in IDEA causes my Core Duo to stutter.

By: vanyatka

vanyatka — Sun, 16 Dec 2007 16:44:42 +0000

You probably right, but I’ve just starting using Eclipse, and cannot tell whether it has improved a lot since the first release, or staying the same it used to be. But on the other hand, usability is a matter of getting used to things. If it is possible to perform certain operation with a reasonable number of key strokes-clicks, you can get used to it. That’s the solace I see in using Eclipse.

By: stephan

stephan — Thu, 13 Dec 2007 20:07:55 +0000

In my opinion Eclipse is not getting better and better. It gets more features but doesn’t improve usability and feel.

By: vanyatka

vanyatka — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 08:02:28 +0000

I must say I’m getting used to Eclipse. Human can get used to everything, it’s just good things take less time for that :)
Anyway, it feels good that Eclipse is a free product, which can only get better and better, and no one can take it from you.

By: vanyatka

vanyatka — Sat, 24 Nov 2007 17:33:56 +0000

I wonder if ppl get paid for developing open-source projects like eclipse. Does anyone pay for eclipse support? For developing new features? I’m just trying to understand what is the driving force behind the project, and how far it can possibly go.

By: vanyatka

vanyatka — Sat, 24 Nov 2007 06:35:51 +0000

Totally agree. Just now needed to comment out some lines in .xml config file. Turns out Eclipse commenting only works with .java source file, not with .xml files. A trifle, but how annoying.

I wish JBoss team could put their efforts into better direction, but to ask them develop plugins for IDEA insted of for Eclipse is ridiculous :)

By: stephan

stephan — Fri, 23 Nov 2007 21:20:53 +0000

I have to work with Eclipse everyday. It’s a pain. The usability is low, the IDE is slow and often does stupid things. A pain. I can’t see what people find in Eclipse.

By: vanyatka

vanyatka — Fri, 23 Nov 2007 08:53:40 +0000

Hi all,

I’m facing the same problem, but in a bit different way. Money is not an issue, I simply can’t make up my mind which one IDEA or Eclipse has a future. Recently I’ve started developing JEE application using JBoss Seam, which is by default equipped with essential plugins for Eclipse, mainly developed by JBoss people, but being an open-source project contributed by ppl arond the globe. IDEA simply don’t have that. You have to adapt, you have to make hacks, you have to wait for someone to make a plugin for new features etc. This is pain. What’s worse is that Eclipse is not a lesser pain, but it’s growing rapidly, at least in terms of functionality. I’m just not sure if I should keep investing my time in IDEA, or grit my teeth and switch over to eclipse, it’s gonna be painful, but in the end I probaly would do it anyway, so the sooner the better.

ps. I envy MS developers in terms of tooling and IDEs. In java world the standards are given the most priority, they are polished, but Tools are far from mature.

By: stephan

stephan — Wed, 10 Oct 2007 05:17:38 +0000

@Curtis: I’ve been using Eclispe 3.3 for some time now, nice but essentially nothing has changed. Code completetion and other features are still not as clever as IDEA is, inspections are not thtat good as IDEA. The Groovy/Grails plugin is more powerfull than the one in Eclipse. More or less Eclipse is a collection of features with no thoughts about usability and the developer in my opinion.

By: Curtis

Curtis — Wed, 10 Oct 2007 02:37:36 +0000

IDEA, quite simply, sucks when compared to Eclipse.

I have used both…extensively. Eclipse is by far the better IDE. The problem, as I see it, is that people like IDEA for what it is and Eclipse for what it isn’t. Eclipse is not IDEA; it is better!

If someone hasn’t tried Eclipse in the 3.3 series, they are doing themselves a disservice.

By: stephan

stephan — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 18:46:27 +0000

@Kenneth, @Nigel: You’re right. My run in with Eclipse on several contract occasions and as the current IDE I use at work makes me think about the $249/year. Eclipse is so much less pleasure. Yes, none compares to IDEA. IDEA is developed with the developer in mind. Eclipse is developed with features and plugins in mind.

Hi Ilia, thanks I’ll do. Otherwise I get a personal license. I decided IDEA is worth the price.

By: Ilia Dumov

Ilia Dumov — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 16:27:14 +0000

Hi Stephan,

I’m the OS guy at JetBrains, but i haven’t seen your request for a license… The easiest way to send us your info is right here: http://www.jetbrains.com/idea/buy/buy.html#openSource. Of course, you can also write me directly at ilya(dot)dumov(at)jetbrains(dot)com. Tell me a little more about your project, and I’ll take a look at it!

By: Nigel

Nigel — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 14:52:22 +0000

Is $249/year such a big issue that you’d rather spend time learning a new IDE?

By: Kenneth

Kenneth — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 09:53:50 +0000

I faced similar situation and decided to get a personal license. It was painful at the beginning but because I personally find not other IDE that fit my needs in a very short time, I got almost no choice. I’ve used Eclipse for 2 years, Netbeans for few months and JDeveloper for weeks but IMHO none compares with IDEA.

By: stephan

stephan — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 09:11:52 +0000

@Andrew: No, not yet. Good idea. They have no German office, so I try the Czech one.

@Dim: Then there seems to be hope that they haven’t forgotten.

By: Dim

Dim — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 08:49:43 +0000

Well I asked for IDEA OSS license too, but still waiting the answer,
Until then I’m using Netbeans 6 that is supposed to be OSS IDEA IMHO :-)
They are tryingo to move all the things from IDEA – even sout TAB works! :-)

Actually I think the game between Eclipse and Netbeans is who’s better implements IDEA features :-)

I’m in the same situation – I left the private company and now work at non commercial institution…

Cheers

By: Andrew Binstock

Andrew Binstock — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 08:05:17 +0000

You sent them an email and got no answer. So, did you call them?

By: stephan

stephan — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 04:43:21 +0000

No No No ;-)

By: Chris Aniszczyk

Chris Aniszczyk — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 22:27:05 +0000

Eclipse loves you, give it a try :)

By: stephan

stephan — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 14:29:17 +0000

Well, yes. It’s been there. I don’t know. This would help with IDEA. Thanks for they idea. I decide on that when I get tatoo working with Radeox ;-)

By: Guillaume Laforge

Guillaume Laforge — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 13:24:27 +0000

What about moving Radeox to Codehaus, for instance?
All Codehaus project developers can use the Codehaus-wide IntelliJ IDEA license.